Cost of Winning: The Monster Mav Chronicles

badassmav

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2013
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Jamul
In light of my last post here, I would like to say that I don't know how teams are getting by with only 55 or 60 amps of total available power to their race cars, unless they are running batteries with massive reserve Ah in them which allows them ample time to run their components with an underpowered charging system before shutdown occurs.

LED light technology, although leaps and bounds above where it once was, still doesn't equal the far reaching, directional beams of light that high intensity discharge lights put out. Joey knows more than most, and certainly more than me on this topic, so perhaps he may choose to chime in here (or he can continue to safely distance himself from me! Ouch! After all, this thread has turned into some sort of a "help" thread for his members.) The biggest benefit of LED's are the quality and quantity of light they emit, vs. the power they require in doing so. Still, they can be out driven. Even in a car as slow as a UTV. When properly aimed and powered, there is no way our HID's can be out driven. They provide light as far as is needed for racing conditions, and certainly recreational applications as well.

I will say that at this years SEMA show, Marc saw the new Hella LED's that share the same cans as the HID's we currently run on our light bar. He was impressed enough that he wanted to try them out on our new build, but they weren't yet available to the public. So, Maybe the time has come for LED technology to shine (pun intended):D!
 

sand shark

Well-Known Member
Mar 30, 2009
1,866
255
83
West Hills, CA
In light of my last post here, I would like to say that I don't know how teams are getting by with only 55 or 60 amps of total available power to their race cars, unless they are running batteries with massive reserve Ah in them which allows them ample time to run their components with an underpowered charging system before shutdown occurs.

LED light technology, although leaps and bounds above where it once was, still doesn't equal the far reaching, directional beams of light that high intensity discharge lights put out. Joey knows more than most, and certainly more than me on this topic, so perhaps he may choose to chime in here (or he can continue to safely distance himself from me! Ouch! After all, this thread has turned into some sort of a "help" thread for his members.) The biggest benefit of LED's are the quality and quantity of light they emit, vs. the power they require in doing so. Still, they can be out driven. Even in a car as slow as a UTV. When properly aimed and powered, there is no way our HID's can be out driven. They provide light as far as is needed for racing conditions, and certainly recreational applications as well.

I will say that at this years SEMA show, Marc saw the new Hella LED's that share the same cans as the HID's we currently run on our light bar. He was impressed enough that he wanted to try them out on our new build, but they weren't yet available to the public. So, Maybe the time has come for LED technology to shine (pun intended):D!
The LED light with the bigger cans project pretty far. VisionX Cannons at 25watts project around a 1000'. The 90 watt version goes something like 2500 feet. I suspect the new Hella's will be about the same.

Reid - It was nice to meet you the other day at Thad's. I was the guy getting the aluminum light bar mounts.
 

badassmav

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2013
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Jamul
The LED light with the bigger cans project pretty far. VisionX Cannons at 25watts project around a 1000'. The 90 watt version goes something like 2500 feet. I suspect the new Hella's will be about the same.

Reid - It was nice to meet you the other day at Thad's. I was the guy getting the aluminum light bar mounts.
Oh yeah.
Likewise Noel. I wish we had more time to chat, 'cause I'm a chatty guy. My sis sometimes refers to me as "chatty cathy"! I should be leaving Thad's shop by tomorrow to bring the car to paint (ahem, I mean powder coating. Crap!)

I didn't realize that you were the "Sandshark". Now that you know I'm a drunken troll, don't share it with the other members! Ha Hee!
 

sand shark

Well-Known Member
Mar 30, 2009
1,866
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West Hills, CA
Oh yeah.
Likewise Noel. I wish we had more time to chat, 'cause I'm a chatty guy. My sis sometimes refers to me as "chatty cathy"! I should be leaving Thad's shop by tomorrow to bring the car to paint (ahem, I mean powder coating. Crap!)

I didn't realize that you were the "Sandshark". Now that you know I'm a drunken troll, don't share it with the other members! Ha Hee!
Haha!!!! You need to carry a club around to be a troll. Can't wait to see the finished product.

Next time hopefully we will have time to chat more. I did not want to take away too much of your time as I know you guys are on a time crunch to get everything done.
 

///Airdam Clutches

Active Member
Nov 14, 2014
358
176
43
LED light bars can project a great distance, upwards of 1000ft on the name brand units. standard white LEDs reflect the light off every dust particle in the air and will blind you in the dust. You can run the Amber LED light bars and the amber color does not reflect the light off the dust. you can see clearly straight thru the dust. the downside is that the amber light does not carry as far as the standard white versions. i had white LED light bars on my offroad equipment that i run at night. they put out SOOOO much light you can see as far as your eyes can see at night, BUT the dust, will blind you. i went to all amber LEDs now, and i plan to stick with them. if you are not moving fast, amber all the way in any offroad situation. you can quickly outrun the projected distance of the amber light bar quite quickly. i have a customer that is pretty tight with VisionX, a sponsored racer, and had some special bar from VisionX that was large projectors i believe in a single row design, that was full amber. i believe he claimed it was something like a $2200 bar. from what he claimed it would reach out and touch things much farther than a standard amber. by the looks of it, it was legit.

the LED bars will put out a huge amount of light, with a little amount of draw, when you are out riding by yourself with nobody in front of you to stir up dust, a standard white bar works amazingly well. BUT if you have any dust in the air, from racing, offroad, following a buddy on a trail, you can leave that white LED bar off cause it will blind you.
 

badassmav

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2013
1,379
182
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Jamul
LED light bars can project a great distance, upwards of 1000ft on the name brand units. standard white LEDs reflect the light off every dust particle in the air and will blind you in the dust. You can run the Amber LED light bars and the amber color does not reflect the light off the dust. you can see clearly straight thru the dust. the downside is that the amber light does not carry as far as the standard white versions. i had white LED light bars on my offroad equipment that i run at night. they put out SOOOO much light you can see as far as your eyes can see at night, BUT the dust, will blind you. i went to all amber LEDs now, and i plan to stick with them. if you are not moving fast, amber all the way in any offroad situation. you can quickly outrun the projected distance of the amber light bar quite quickly. i have a customer that is pretty tight with VisionX, a sponsored racer, and had some special bar from VisionX that was large projectors i believe in a single row design, that was full amber. i believe he claimed it was something like a $2200 bar. from what he claimed it would reach out and touch things much farther than a standard amber. by the looks of it, it was legit.

the LED bars will put out a huge amount of light, with a little amount of draw, when you are out riding by yourself with nobody in front of you to stir up dust, a standard white bar works amazingly well. BUT if you have any dust in the air, from racing, offroad, following a buddy on a trail, you can leave that white LED bar off cause it will blind you.
Hey Adam! Good morning. How's it coming with that new-fangled thing-a-mi-bobber I sent you?
 

badassmav

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2013
1,379
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Jamul
HEY!! leave him alone!!!! he is still working on my disaster and i need it soon.
git to the back of the line TROLL!!! haha.
F-ing hilarious.
Nearly blew beer out my nose! Funny reading the truth from other people! Hey, Joey, I'm just tugging your leg. I know you support me and my thread. Thanks for the opportunity your site offers, and not censoring anybody's posts.
 

SickStick

New Member
Dec 31, 2014
10
0
0
Nor-Cal
Hey Reid, I was wondering what the pros/cons & reasoning behind relocating the diff & building longer A-arms versus extending the rear subframe to gain more wheel base. I assume your goal was to have longer cv longevity with the straighter cv angles. I'm looking to long travel my maverick & add another 6-8" of rear wheel base. I run 30" tires and ride basically every type of terrain. Primarily desert,dunes & rock crawling. With the 30" tires I rub in the rear when suspension is fully compressed. Looking to stretch the wheel base and gain the benefits of the long travel as well. Easiest way looks to be extending the rear half of the car but I would still have some pretty severe cv angles when I flex out in the rocks. I would prefer to relocate the diff & have longer a-arms but then Im not sure the best way to tie in the radius rods & not sure how bad it will effect the sway bar strength. I even thought of replacing the rear section & run a trailing arm system much like the xp & cat since they do so well in the high speed desert rides but I like the a-arm system better in the rocks. Looking to gather as much info from the experts before I dive into this project. Thanks
 

mearsman

Active Member
Nov 2, 2011
459
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After Reid chimes in expels knowledge, I've already offered to come over and show you exactly how I triangulated the rear arms to achieve the 6" stretch that I did on my maverick. It's intimidating at first be uses you don't know what you don't know. But after you do the first arm, it's a cake walk.
By Reid taking the time to teach me so much about he function and laws of suspension, it's allowed me to tackle a project such as this.

Reid walked me through the entire process of stretching my maverick. The reason you don't just extend the rear clip of the car is because of ye side load that is being put on the rear axle bearings and the hub itself. The compound angle that the maverick runs , in the rear in my opinion and many others, is a recipe for disaster. This is the reason for signing the rear axles with the rear hub. The optimal angle is a true 90*. Being as bulletproof as possible is the key to success in the desert, song with having a bit of luck.
 

SickStick

New Member
Dec 31, 2014
10
0
0
Nor-Cal
Hey Jim, I plan on taking you up on your offer & using your expertise as well. Just trying to gather all the knowledge I can before I tackle this project & decide exactly how I want to do this while incorporating long travel. The side load on the wheel brgs makes sense, I was more focused on cv angles not even thinking wheel brg load. It is definitely something I have been putting off & thinking twice about but believe that it is going to be a much better machine.
 

badassmav

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2013
1,379
182
63
56
Jamul
Hey Reid, I was wondering what the pros/cons & reasoning behind relocating the diff & building longer A-arms versus extending the rear subframe to gain more wheel base. I assume your goal was to have longer cv longevity with the straighter cv angles. I'm looking to long travel my maverick & add another 6-8" of rear wheel base. I run 30" tires and ride basically every type of terrain. Primarily desert,dunes & rock crawling. With the 30" tires I rub in the rear when suspension is fully compressed. Looking to stretch the wheel base and gain the benefits of the long travel as well. Easiest way looks to be extending the rear half of the car but I would still have some pretty severe cv angles when I flex out in the rocks. I would prefer to relocate the diff & have longer a-arms but then Im not sure the best way to tie in the radius rods & not sure how bad it will effect the sway bar strength. I even thought of replacing the rear section & run a trailing arm system much like the xp & cat since they do so well in the high speed desert rides but I like the a-arm system better in the rocks. Looking to gather as much info from the experts before I dive into this project. Thanks
I've got some great responses to your inquiries. Just have to give me a day or two to find the time to reply. Parker is coming quick, and the build is coming slow.
 

hardcharger81

New Member
Nov 30, 2014
28
0
1
Elk Grove CA
Not to get off topic, but where are you at SickStick? It says Nor Cal on your ID. I too have a Maverick and I'm also interested in changing the rear of my car.

I'm a fabricator by trade, and have a shop, although my experience is in commercial and industrial fabrication, maybe with some of mearsman's and Reid's info we could stretch our cars out.

Also, thanks for your post, I had all the same questions. Saved me some typing.

Or we could just go trail riding once my leg heals. :D

Ok, back to the thread and the knowledge.
 

BrianReno

Member
Aug 19, 2012
202
13
18
Reno, NV
I asked Reid in a PM regarding measurements and more details of the arms for the Monster Mav, he graciously accepted and asked that I put it in this thread for all to benefit from. He said it will take some time due to the new build and trying to finish it up for Parker. Thanks Reid you da man...
 

badassmav

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2013
1,379
182
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Jamul
Suspension re-work: An Overview:
I'll preface the info I'm going to share by saying that by simply cutting off the rear clip of the maverick and re-locating it back x amount of inches rearward is not a valid nor effective way to get your car to perform any better than stock. It is a simple attempt at fixing a complex problem. If your efforts are to be applied in this fashion, it would be better to do that type of surgery to the front end of the car.

I don't know the first thing about KOH and that style of competition. Truth be told, it scares the beguezzes out of me to think a car I cradled and massaged into a new beast would be subjected to such torture.

There are some important do's and don'ts when re-working the rear of the Maverick. There are also, in my mind, a couple of deal breakers as well. We do want to align the rear cv's to gain more reliable power to the ground. We do not however, want to do this at the expense of an undesirable fore to aft weight distribution. Rather than bore you with technical details on how or why I chose the method of modifying the rear, I'll just give the jest of it right here, then come back shortly with dimensional data and mechanical and physical changes that you will need to know in order to make the rear of your Mav "Badass". After all, if it was an engineering degree you were after, you wouldn't be seeking it from a guy who drinks his breakfast and lives in his RV with his 2 dogs:eek:.

So, in short, I maintained all of the stock pivot points as they were located on the frame from the manufacturer. Had to to legally compete in SCORE and BITD. I didn't try to justify what constitutes stock suspension pivot points so I can easily achieve desired results. I only took the rear carrier (outer hub/upright), and all of it's hardware, and moved it back 8 1/4 ", while moving the rear diff back only 4 1/2". This gave me the cv joint alignment I was seeking. So, simple math here says that the cv joint misalignment from the factory is approximately 3 3/4".

I'll let that stay for a bit, and come back later.
 

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